Question #1:
You're welcome and glad to hear about everything! Yes, God is good!
Can't say this enough, but, once again, thank you for your ministry Dr.
Luginbill. It is an understatement for me to say (absolutely no flattery
intended here) that I got more from your ministry in one month (as you once
said) than 20 some years attending churches. I give all the glory to God but I
can't imagine where I would be without you (and you have been the most
significant contributing factor to my own ministry). I can't imagine doing
things the way most churches do and how sad and depressing that would be if I
did. I must admit that hearing so many wrong things being said from different
believers in different churches and groups (some very recent as you know) has
aroused my zeal so much that it helps me to remember what a blessing it is to be
able to study under your ministry.
Thank you for being a good friend and mentor and for your patience and
understanding in taking the time to answer my questions. I don't go "fishing for
answers" but just genuinely want to know the truth because that is what we're
all after. I suppose it's the case of "something pops up that I want to know"
and either I don't fully understand it or just want to understand the arguments
or details better (or how could I address this argument, etc.). I know that some
of the questions I've asked have seemed very simple but I think it's good to
further refine my understanding of those matters because even though I believe
them (whatever subject have you), when I hear what others have to say about them
or engage them on it myself , I sometimes come to discover that my understanding
of the details wasn't quite as good as I thought and that I need/needed to go
back and rethink it a little bit (even if I agree with the belief/teaching in
principle). Water baptism is one example as you've seen. The blood of Christ
being another.
Just started going through peripatology and then
I will begin the Hebrews series (links).
Also going to start studying through the book of James to take notes on that and
post to the site (Curt said it was fine if I utilized his lessons for Greek
words and definitions; link to
Bible Academy). Progress for the site is going to be slow and I'm not sure
how much I'm gonna get done but when I consider everything I've already posted,
it isn't as if I don't have that much already there (I just recently finished
rereading/going back through all the material on the site to make edits and
refinements: link to Bible Driven website).
I only say that because I want my readers to have a reasonable amount of content
to chew on to keep them busy until I can get more stuff out. I do what I can do
but I'll never be anything compared to you or Curt and that's ok with me. As
long as I'm doing what the Lord wants me to do, then that's all I care about.
Your brother in Christ,
Response #1:
Wow! Thanks a lot! That's very encouraging, and I greatly appreciate it, my
friend!
On questions, you always have a way of hitting a new angle that I've never heard
or considered before . . . and that is ALL to the good. So please to keep 'em
coming.
Good to hear that you are making progress on the ministry in spite of all you're
dealing with. That is a victory in and of itself. In terms of quantity, Ichthys
started with only about the first twenty or so installments of
the Peter series (and most of them are
pretty short). You're already well past that. And if you keep at it, one day
you'll turn around and there'll be a WHOLE lot . . . or at least plenty for what
we're being called to do, keeping all who come to you for spiritual sustenance
"well fed". So keep at it!
Keeping you in my daily prayers as well, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #2:
Good morning,
I wrote to you a month or so ago and decided that I’d write again since I have
something on my mind. I know we are meant to grow, progress, and produce. The
first two are no problem for me as my day-to-day life revolves around Christ and
my relationship with Him. He is always on my mind from the music I listen to,
podcasts, my quiet time, and even my reading as I lay in bed. I know I am
progressing in my faith because of how I’ve changed and because of some huge
prayers he’s answered in my life. The way God has moved in regard to my
daughters and wife has been nothing short of incredible. I could thank Him every
second for the rest of my life and it still wouldn’t even approach how thankful
I am. The thought of spending eternity worshiping Christ alongside my wife,
daughters, and the rest of my family brings me so much joy and happiness. To be
honest, I’m ready for it now.
All of that brings me to what this correspondence is about. I really feel like I
am not producing for Christ. I don’t feel like I am upholding my end of this at
all. Unfortunately, I really struggle with having a lot of love for people. I
generally like to be alone and spending time with my family. Lately, I’ve been
praying for my heart, in this regard, to change, and for me to have more love in
my heart for people. I most definitely want to complete my mission for Christ
and want to please Him. I just generally want nothing to do with this world and
I get so frustrated with people when I see them running after worldly things
while ignoring Christ, His kingdom, and the amazing gift of salvation. I make
sure I am praying for family, everyone at work, friends, and random people that
I come across and remember. I do want everyone to be saved and honestly cannot
understand how people aren’t concerned about it. Especially considering how
close we are to the Tribulation and the ending of this age.
I do realize and ponder sometimes that I might not be where God wants me to be,
and He is still refining me so that I can produce for Him. Who knows, maybe that
will be during the Tribulation. I love Him and want to make him proud and really
just want to complete the tasks that He has placed in front of me. Do you have
any advice regarding all of this?
Also, I want to thank you again for all of your work and dedication to Christ.
Ichthys has really blessed me and played a huge role in my spiritual growth. I
hope all is well on your end.
In Christ,
Response #2:
Thanks for your testimony. It's great to hear all the wonderful things that the
Lord has done for you AND your gratitude! We all need to be more grateful to Him
and for Him. After all, if He hadn't suffered and died for all of our sins, we
would have been doomed.
As to ministry, it is true that the Lord has a ministry for each and every one
of us (1Cor.12:5); these correspond to the spiritual gifts we have been given.
We all have gifts, usually a combination of them, and we are all different.
As each one [of us] has received a [particular spiritual] gift, [so let us be] ministering it to each other as good stewards of the multifaceted grace of God.
1st Peter 4:10
God's grace in this regard is "variegated", "multifaceted", "manifold", i.e., it
comes in many different forms and "packages". As a result, there are as many
ministries as there are believers. God knows you and knows what strengths and
weaknesses you have, what talents and what gifts, what opportunities and life
restrictions. Prayer is a ministry. Witnessing His witness with your life is a
ministry. One should not see ministry through the denominational "cookie-cutter"
lens of what is a ministry and who is a minister.
As we grow, we are motivated as you are to help our brothers and sisters grow
too. That is the essence of ministry, namely, leading others to the truth
(evangelism), or helping them learn the truth (through supporting or being
directly involved in teaching ministries or other charitable activities which
make it possible to live and learn the truth). There is plenty of wasted effort
out there in the church-visible, so as you consider this issue, keep in mind
that guilt is a deceptive motivator. Also, just because something is painful and
something you don't want to do doesn't mean that it is something you should do.
That is the other side of the road in the other ditch, the opposite of sitting
on one's hands and not taking up whatever ministry challenge the Lord gives you.
I'm guessing from this email that you know yourself pretty well, that you know
what sorts of things you are suited for and not suited for. So pray, listen to
the Spirit, be on watch for opportunities . . . and above all continue to grow,
because the Lord uses prepared people. And we can never be over-prepared when it
comes to spiritual growth or engagement in ministry.
Here are some links which may prove helpful (they will also lead to others):
Ministry and Preparation for Ministry XXII
Ministry and Preparation for Ministry IV
Ministry and Preparation for Ministry III
Ministry and Preparation for Ministry II
Ministry and Preparation for Ministry I
Do feel free to write me back again about this, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #3:
Thanks for getting back to me and for those links. I’m just about done with
chapter 10 of Hebrews and will start making my way through those links.
While I’m writing to you, I might as well ask another question. What is your
opinion on R.C Sproul? In your opinion, is he biblical in his approach and
analysis? I always like to end my day by reading right before I go to bed. This
reading is separate from my Bible study but still revolves around Christ and the
Bible. The last thing I want is to waste time reading material that isn't
helping me grow and progress as I should be.
Response #3:
I've heard of him, but I wouldn't pass myself as an expert on what he's done or
teaches.
I do note that he is a very strong Calvinist so I would disagree on that point.
Is there anything in particular you were wondering about? The proof is in the
pudding. If you are being fed by any ministry, it is likely good; if you are not
(or receiving false teaching), then . . . (see the link:
"The Fruit Test").
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #4:
Thanks Bob for this!
I realise that as I move forward spiritually, especially towards ministry, that
things will weigh up against me. I know that Peter wrote 'don't think it
strange..' Some things are happening to me that can only be supernatural in
origin. One by one __'s family and friends are turning on me. I haven't said
anything or done anything but they are pushing me out and shunning me. It's very
strange as there is no cause to it!
[omitted]
I am not perfect of course and I have my struggles and find it hard knowing what
to prioritise and coping with my own family dysfunction but I know I have not
done anything personally to these people. My mind immediately turned to
scripture...
John 15:18-25
“If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first. If you belonged to
the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the
world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you.
Remember what I told you: ‘A servant is not greater than his master.’ If they
persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they
will obey yours also. They will treat you this way because of my name, for they
do not know the one who sent me. If I had not come and spoken to them, they
would not be guilty of sin; but now they have no excuse for their sin. Whoever
hates me hates my Father as well. If I had not done among them the works no one
else did, they would not be guilty of sin. As it is, they have seen, and yet
they have hated both me and my Father. But this is to fulfill what is written in
their Law: ‘They hated me without reason.’
Psalm 35:19
Do not let those gloat over me
who are my enemies without cause;
do not let those who hate me without reason
maliciously wink the eye.
Psalm 69:4
Those who hate me without reason
outnumber the hairs of my head;
many are my enemies without cause,
those who seek to destroy me.
I am forced to restore
what I did not steal.
Your friend in Jesus,
p.s. though conversely (and happily) the first person reached out to my ministry
today! Someone thought opening his crown chakra/Kundalini awakening was the mark
of the beast. I reassured him that it wasn't whilst encouraging him to stay away
from the New Age/Occult as it is evil. I sent him a link to what you wrote about
the mark and prayed for him. This really encouraged me! Maybe this shunning is a
test from the Lord to prepare me for the intense shunning I will receive through
the Tribulation? I realise that whatever the reason, the Lord is always with me
and will always be my friend even if I get to a point where I have no others.
Response #4:
When the evil one isn't having success attacking us personally, when we are finally refusing to be tempted to do what is wrong or pressured away from doing what is right, attacking those close to us is often the next best thing (or those close to them). This will ratchet up the pressure on us indirectly. When we are emotionally upset, even if the cause of that upset is not the result of anything we have done or failed to do, we will still "feel bad", and ,"feeling bad", we will be tempted to give in to that pressure and make a bad decision, whether of commission (doing something spiritually stupid we otherwise wouldn't do) or omission (failing in our spiritual responsibilities – especially devastating if we have ministries upon which others are relying). But I do know that the Lord helps us. That is true even if we are not Simon pure in all of our prior dealings. Who is? Only our Lord was.
A psalm of David. When he fled from his son Absalom. LORD, how many are my foes! How many rise up against me! Many are saying of me, “God will not deliver him.” But you, LORD, are a shield around me, my glory, the One who lifts my head high. I call out to the LORD, and he answers me from his holy mountain. I lie down and sleep; I wake again, because the LORD sustains me. I will not fear though tens of thousands assail me on every side. Arise, LORD! Deliver me, my God! Strike all my enemies on the jaw; break the teeth of the wicked. From the LORD comes deliverance. May your blessing be on your people.
Psalm 3:1-8 NIV
As it says in the prescript, David wrote this while fleeing from Absalom. And
why was he fleeing from his own son? Because he was trying to kill David. But
why did this happen? Because David had killed Uriah after impregnating his wife.
No question that David was horribly wrong to do what he did. But the Lord
forgave him (2Sam.12:13; Ps.32:1-5; 51:1ff.). David never doubted the Lord's
forgiveness. As a result, even though he was being counted out by his enemies on
account of his dire circumstances, he still had joy in the Lord and absolute
confidence in the Lord's coming deliverance of him – and that confidence was not
misplaced.
So if we are being attacked, and if we know that the attack is not the result of
some terrible failure on our part for which we are being disciplined, since we
like David have absolute confidence in the Lord's forgiveness and deliverance
even when we are guilty, how much more should we not be joyous and confident in
His help when the trouble is not our fault?
(31) So what shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who is against us? (32) He who did not spare His own Son, but handed Him over for our sake, how will He not also graciously give us everything [we need] along with [that gift of] Him? (33) Who will [dare to] bring charges against God's elect? God is the One who is pronouncing [us] justified. (34) Who is he that condemns [us]? Christ Jesus is the One who died [condemned in our place], and the One, moreover, who was raised from the dead [for us], who is [seated] at the right hand of God, who is also making petitions on our behalf. (35) What will separate us from Christ's love? Tribulation? Or privation? Or persecution? Or hunger? Or destitution? Or danger? Or violence? (36) As it is written, "For your sake we are being put to death all day long. We were accounted as sheep for slaughter". (37) But in all such things we are decisively victorious through Him who loved us [enough to do what He did for us]. (38) For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, neither angelic nor human authorities, neither things present nor things to come, neither heavenly powers, (39) be they the highest [of the elect] or the lowest [of the fallen], nor any other created thing [on this earth] will be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 8:31-39
I draw great confidence from your wonderful handling of this test, my friend! Keep plugging away at your ministry. The pressures of today may well fly away tomorrow, especially if we are resolved to do what is right no matter what.
But he gives us more grace. That is why Scripture says: “God opposes the proud but shows favor to the humble.” Submit yourselves, then, to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. Come near to God and he will come near to you.
James 4:6-8a NIV
Keeping up the prayers.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #5:
Dear Teacher,
How have you been, Sir?
[omitted] I am hoping to be done shortly so that I can return and refocus on my
training and some writing on Bible teaching too and Greek, hopefully (that has
been coming again in fits and starts). My laptop went bad, and I am hoping to
get some help to replace it.
My head is still a mess about things on the spiritual progress and training
side. I figure a lot of that is because I allow guilt-tripping from the enemy.
Or else I really just have been going backward rather than forward. I sometimes
wish I could have you assess me spiritually to be sure that I am pushing forward
not sliding backwards and maybe even at a fast clip, but I remember frequently
what you say about the Lord's opinion being all that matters.
[omitted]
I miss writing Bible studies and being an assistant to your ministry, helping
out with anyone you sent my way. That's part of my own upset and maybe the
enemy's guilt-tripping too. I haven't felt much like a jewel that you found in
quite a while now. I dearly wish that I still am that to you and to the Lord,
but I don't feel very much like that. Like you say, feelings have nothing to do
with it, and it only matters what the Lord thinks. So, I try to push forward
regardless. The trouble was being persuaded that I was moving forward at all.
Hebrews 12 was delicious. Thank you for your incredible example of faithfulness
in all things, Sir.
Your student in Jesus,
PS.: I think I've asked about these before but perhaps not particularly clearly:
How would you translate and interpret Luke 22:36 and Ephesians 4:28? The first
seems to me to suggest (in the English translations) that the pastor-teacher
should only bother to take a purse if he already had one at the point of his
deployment. The second seems to me to suggest that the thing that the former
thief should be working at is something that provides value to some employer,
client, or customer. That would mean that the former thief should choose a
career path that is useful, I assume, economically. Is this how you see the
passages?
Response #5:
My pleasure! Thanks also for the update. Sorry to hear about the laptop. I will
add this concern to my list. I know that you are still in a sort of frustrating
period. But the Lord will bring you through and lead you to the right place and
situation. I'm certainly praying for that. You may not be able to do the writing
you'd like at present, but you can still keep reading and preparing for your
Bible-teaching ministry in the meantime.
Re: Luke 22:36, the main point of interpretation for this passage is that during
their time of special ministry, the twelve apostles (and also the 72) were not
to provide for themselves but would be supernaturally provided for as a sign of
the kingdom they were announcing. That will be true of the 144,000 as well. In
between, for the rest of us, we are to take reasonable measures in all things
(as in self-defense, for example).
Re: Ephesians 4:28, this is a standard theme of Paul's, specifically applied
here to some who were formerly thieves (and who may have been or been tempted to
revert). All believers should work for a living so as not to burden others but
instead to be able to help brethren in need. So this is not a pastor-teacher
exclusive verse. In fact, pastor-teachers are the exception since "a workman is
worthy of his pay" (and that was the rationale for the support of the 12/72/144K
as well: Matt.10:10). Congregations are now responsible for supporting their
pastor-teachers (Gal.6:6; 1Tim.5:17-18); although Paul deliberately didn't
accept support from the Corinthians (1Cor.9:13-18; 2Cor.11:7-11), they were a
"special" case; he did from the Philippians and others.
Keeping you in my daily prayers, my friend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #6:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
Apologies for the late response. Thank you for the explanation on the "greater
gifts" and on love. I want to minister to others, but I'm feeling less competent
these days. Perhaps I'm just realizing how much I truly don't know. Seems I have
lots of questions these days.
I've been going through some things (I think it's testing?) and I feel as though
God is working on me to help me grow more. I'm not always sure exactly how to
sort it all out, but I do know and trust that God is using it for good, even
when it's painful.
I'm also running into things where I know that I believe something, but I don't
always know "why" I believe it or how to properly understand why a position is
wrong (I just know in my heart that it is). For instance, a conversation I had
with __ who quoted Revelation 3:10 as a reason why __ believes the Church will
be raptured prior to the Tribulation. I didn't have a good enough understanding
of that particular verse (until I went and studied it in the Coming Tribulation
series).
__ also made a comment the other day that concerned me. __ was talking about the
book of Enoch (I'm not sure what __ believes about it, exactly), and then __
said something along the lines of, "for instance, how do we know that Proverbs
is inspired or if it's just the sayings of a wise man? It's in the Bible, but
these things were decided by man." __ did say that Solomon got his wisdom for
God. I was just concerned and surprised that __ said that, I never would have
expected that out of __. So I went and read some of the things on Ichthys about
Apocrypha and pseudepigrapha. There is so much to learn.
Please pray for me to have wisdom and clarity and confidence in the path I
should take (confidence from the Lord), I have some important decisions coming
up and I just want to follow God's Will.
A person’s steps are directed by the Lord. How then can anyone understand their
own way? - Proverbs 20:24
In their hearts humans plan their course, but the Lord establishes their steps.
- Proverbs 16:9
Do these verses mean that God guides us even when we don't know exactly where we
are going? I know He works everything out for the spiritual good of believers. I
don't always know where I am going or where I should go.
Well, I will close here. Oh, some good news! My good friend had her first little
boy around Thanksgiving weekend. She had a long labor and has had some
significant health issues in the past, so it is a wonderful praise that she and
baby got through it well! So that is a very happy thing that has happened
recently!
Respectfully,
P.S. shared with the group that your vote on December 5 had good news (if I
understand correctly)? And __ shared with the group that we can pray for your
doctor's tests coming up and more issues at the University. I will be praying
for you.
Response #6:
You're most welcome, my friend.
In terms of these sorts of questions, one would have to be super-well versed in
all manner of apologetic verses and arguments to be able "on the fly" to field
completely the objections of people who just aren't willing 1) to believe the
truth, or 2) give up pet (incorrect) theories. We are happy to share with those
who want to hear our pearls. We can't expect to be able to refute all their
arguments when in reality these are always masking something deeper. Re: "the
rapture". No one who holds that fast does so except out of a desire for this
fantasy to be true regardless of biblical reality. They have to come to the point of
accepting the Bible beyond all else before giving it up. What could you have
said? Perhaps you could have quoted some verses from Matthew 24. Stating
positive things you know and that the Bible supports directly is always better
than trying to deconstruct someone's wrong take on a doctrine or passage. Re:
"Enoch", "men" made it up. Everyone knows instinctively that the Bible is the
Word of God. People reject that absolute truth because they don't want be under
the Bible's authority but rather be free to pick and choose what they'll believe
and what they won't. These sorts of "ticks" are present throughout Laodicea . .
. even with those we know and love very much (believe me, I know).
In short, I think you are doing well and handling things correctly. If someone
you care about is dead wrong about some biblical principle, through your witness
of the life and through your careful seeding in of truths and perspectives that
the Spirit will affirm, they may, at some point, become willing to respond to
your Spirit-filled witness. But you're not going to argue them out of false
beliefs, even if you're very good at it – because they hold these positions for
a reason that has nothing to do with objective truth.
In terms of divine guidance, we accept that God knows everything and that we
know nothing except what He's shared with us. But if we act on the truth He's
given us, opening our hearts to the Spirit's guidance, we stand a pretty good
chance of making some better than average decisions. And God is able to correct
us if we're making a big mistake (cf. His warding off of David's initial
intention to slay Abigail's husband Nabal). If we are walking close to the Lord,
it all works out for good because He works everything out for good for those who
love Him (Rom.8:28), even if we make mistakes as we all do. So we need not allow
ourselves to become paralyzed about these things. We consider in the Spirit, put
things to the Lord in prayer, seek prudent counsel where appropriate, and put it
in the Lord's hands (whatever "it" is).
Regarding health and work, I'll be copying here in a bit on a separate matter in
an email all of the members of "the group" with whom I'm in regular contact
(stay tuned).
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #7:
Hello Bob,
After a long time I decided to contact you again because I have been discussing
biblical topics with a guy that is quite law based in his beliefs. He is also
taking verses out of context which then ends in those false teachings he is
spreading on the internet. I also had an argument with a guy about Hebrews 10:26
and I explained the context but he somehow didn't accept it? What is your
opinion on this/do you have any tips?
Blessings
Response #7:
Good to hear back from you, my friend.
When it comes to apologetics, that is really not my area. This ministry teaches
the Bible to believers who are interested in learning. Confronting false
teaching in the public square, whether from putative believers or unbelievers,
can be a valid ministry from the Lord (we all have different gifts and we are
all called to different ministries), but the skills and approaches to be used
have to be special for this particular type of ministry. For the rest of us, our
Lord's words are good to keep in mind:
"Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces."
Matthew 7:6 NKJV
If it is a case of a person being wrong but being willing to listen to correction,
that is one thing – and no doubt a good thing for a brother to intervene and
help (Jas.5:19-20). But if a person is hardened against the truth, it is well to
ask what we are doing in arguing with them. An apologetic ministry has as its
main goal not the turning around of the false source but the repudiation of the
false teaching in the hearing of those who are listening. As mentioned, this is
a very special type of ministry (our Lord did a lot of this in the course of His
ministry but mostly in circumstances where His true teaching was being directly
opposed).
So in terms of how to argue against those who are determined to stop their ears
against the truth (e.g., Ps.58:3-5), I don't have any special insight – except
to say that praying for them is never amiss.
In terms of the truth about the Law and this passage you ask about, there is, as
you probably know, a great deal in the new
Hebrews series (link). Here are a couple of pertinent links:
Wishing you and yours a wonderful Christmas and a blessed 2025!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #8:
Hello Doc,
It's been a bit. Hope all is well with you and yours! We are studying 1st
Timothy and Women in ministry in our Sunday school class, and I had some
questions I need your help on. As you are well aware, this is (and has been) a
controversial subject in the church. I have perused Ichthys to gather what I
could related to the topic, but my questions primarily relate to the Greek
language, as you have taught me a bit about those who try to manipulate the
scriptures by "hiding behind the language." Apologies in advance if I misspell
any of the Greek.
In 1st Tim. 2:12, I think the word for "permit" is "epitrepo" which I think
means "to allow or give permission." One of the viewpoints presented, the author
claimed that this word is only used 19 times in the New Testament and is always
used to address a specific situation ( i.e; therefore, Paul must only be
addressing the issue Timothy is facing in Ephesus, and it doesn't apply to us
now.) This argument smells a little fishy to me, because if we use that logic,
well, we can toss out most of Paul's epistles (or at least the ones we don't
like or find offensive) because Paul often is addressing specific issues in the
church. Does this viewpoint hold any water?
In the same verse, Paul uses the words exercise "authority" which I believe is
the Greek "authenteo." Another viewpoint claims this is the only time in the New
Testament where this word is used for authority, with the rest using the more
familiar "exousia." I think "authenteo" means "to have authority over" or to
"exercise authority over" and can even mean "to domineer" or "usurp authority."
(I am aware this word is the source of significant scholarly debate.) (I guess
the idea is, since it's only used here, it must mean something different than
the usual word for authority.) I am no grammar expert, but it seems to me this
is just a stronger version of the normal word. Thoughts?
I believe in one of your posts, or teachings you stated that you don't believe
that women are given the gift of "pastor teacher." Can you help me with
scriptural support with this.
Can you also explain a little better for me why Paul goes back to the beginning
to explain "why" he doesn't permit women to teach or exercise authority over a
man. I read what you had, but sometimes I can't wrap my head around it. Sorry!
Coming from a Fire Department background (and you from the military), I
understand the importance of a "Command Structure" and following the chain of
command. Is this what Paul is alluding to? God's "Chain of Command." Or am I in
the wrong ballpark?
For the record, I am completely in agreement with what you teach, I just can't
articulate it as smoothly as you do! Any help would be appreciated!
Praying for you and your ministry!
In Christ our Lord,
Response #8:
Good to hear from you.
I'm aware that this and similar passages are hard ones for many to hear. But it
is the Bible and we need to accept it once we understand what it says and not
try to manipulate it into something we'd rather hear – as with every other
scripture which may cause us concern for one reason or another.
There is no Jew or Greek, slave or free, male and female; since you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3:29 CSB
First thing to mention is that believers are "all one" in Christ. There is no spiritual advantage to being any particular race or gender or nationality. Every believer has the opportunity to win the three crowns. In terms of men and women, we are all " joint-heirs of the grace of life" (1Pet.3:7 ASV). Scripture records many great women in history, even some who, like Deborah, had leadership roles and who like Hanna were given to prophecy scripture (see the link: Great Women in the Bible).
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church.
1st Corinthians 14:34-35 NIV
Second thing is that as the passage above should indicate, these commands from Paul have to do with the functioning of local churches only. In the very next chapter (and chapter divisions are not original so we can say in the very same context) Paul will give the rules for pastor-teachers and deacons, as well as characterizing what a local church is and should be:
But [I am giving you these instructions] so that in case I am delayed you may know how a person must comport himself in a house of God (i.e., a church) – which is an assembly of the living God, a pillar and a support of the truth.
1st Timothy 3:15
So these comments about authority and silence have to do with the proper conduct
of the local assembly whose number one function is to teach the truth. This is
hard for modern day Americans in particular to grasp since "church" means many
things but the idea of teaching the truth being present not to say primary is
not what most are familiar with. In the context of a proper church, if we could
imagine that for a moment, disorder is not permitted. If people are speaking out
of turn and not responding to authority, well, it's like if a teacher loses
control of the class and all the students are carrying on and paying no
attention. Nothing can be learned until order is restored. This was apparently
an issue in some of the early churches and Timothy in particular seems to have
been a good man but not much of a disciplinarian (since Paul, for example, has
to tell the Corinthians specifically not to give him a hard time for that
reason: 1Cor.16:10-11). So both of these passages have primarily to do with
keeping order in the local assembly. No talking out of turn when the Word of God
is being taught. No questioning and objecting or otherwise carrying on – or no
one will get anything out of it.
Does this mean that women were particularly to blame? As I have written
elsewhere, rather I think it's the case that Paul singles out the women in order
to shame the men – who otherwise would take offense. NO ONE is supposed to talk
out of turn. But since he points to the women, the men now have to be doubly
careful (if you see what I mean). Paul understood the various ins and outs of
gender expectations in his day. If they are not exactly the same today, in any
case we can get the main point: NO ONE is allowed to disrupt the teaching the
Word.
That brings me to your two other (related) questions (and please feel free to
write me back if I miss something).
First, what does authenteo mean? It is true that it's not a very well
documented verb, but the noun from which it is derived is common enough so that
the meaning "act with authority" must be correct. If there is a difference
between this and exousiazo it is that the former is more autocratic and
absolute, not less so. "To allow", epitrepo, is very common, so the
verbal gymnastics being practiced by the person you cite are definitely
specious. In Greek or English, the gist is clear enough. But the application is
important not to miss. The sphere of teaching and exercising authority is, as
described above and in the context of what comes next in chapter three, the
local church. Women are not allowed to be the governing authorities nor the
teacher in the main assembly. Part of the reason for that is the limitation of
men to be able to emotionally accept female authority (especially in that
culture). We might be inclined to say, "too bad for them!", but the plan of God
takes everything into account with the view of maximum growth possible for all.
So if women can "take it" but men can't, then having male pastor-teachers and
governing authorities in a local church makes practical sense even if it doesn't
seem equitable. In the end, we should all want as many of our brothers and
sisters as possible to get as far along spiritually as possible. So we all ought
to be willing to take out of the way any actual stumbling blocks to that
progress.
To pastor, to teach, requires the gift first but not only that. Paul gives a
long list in the next chapter of the qualifications for pastors and elders, and
we would certainly add – since there is now no more miraculous provision of the
truth through prophecy and other gifts – first acquiring the tools and education
and experience necessary to actually feed the flock. And unless and until even a
man with that gift is prepared in every way he needs to be prepared to feed
himself and others, then he too "needs to be silent in church".
Do women ever receive the gift? Women are natural teachers and it is the rare
man who has not in his life profited from learning from women: mothers, aunts,
grandmothers, sisters and various school teachers, professors, etc., etc. Who
doubts that a woman may be gifted to teach? Are there ministries for women?
EVERYONE is gifted by the Spirit and we are all given ministries by the Lord . .
. when we've grown to the point of being able to fulfill them. And many of these
for women have traditionally and continue to be in teaching. The one thing Paul
says "no" to is for women to be pastoring churches and being in authority over
men therein. Please understand. I'm just interpreting the Bible. I'm not going
to go on any crusade to tell other people how to do things. If a local church
wants to have a woman pastor, far be it from me to get involved in their
business. I do hasten to add that I don't know of many if any local churches
which look like the churches we've grown up with actually teaching anything
substantial and in truth and in depth. So whether they have men or women as
their pastors to me makes no particular difference.
So I leave it to individual believers with the help of the Spirit and being
informed by the Word and prayer to figure out what their gifts are and to be led
into the ministry the Lord has for them as they grow in the truth. If for a
women this leads to teaching in some venue, then as Peter says, "who am I to
think I can stand in God's way?" (Acts 11:17). And if the men aren't doing their
jobs, then would it be surprising if the Lord chastened them by raising up a
woman to do it for them (à la Deborah)?
But, man or woman, if a person is not actually gifted by the Spirit and being
led by the Lord to do whatever it is, having been prepared properly for whatever
it is, then it's not good and I would advise staying away from any such
"ministry". How do we know? It's the old "fruit
test" (link), or "the proof is in the pudding".
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #9:
Thanks so much for this doc! I understand and agree with all you wrote. I too
try not to go on a crusade about these things because from my point of view (and
I believe yours too) when it’s just preaching that is void of any real content,
and not teaching by someone so gifted and prepared, well then it doesn’t matter
who it is. Thanks so much for getting back to me so quickly. Have a great week!
In Christ
Response #9:
It's my pleasure.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #10:
Hello Bob!
Yes, I was referring to that verse, thank you for the answer! But now I have
another question. How do I know what the Lord wants from me? Should I run around
and spread the gospel everywhere or be silent and spread it only with people I
know; should I spread it silently or loudly on streets, etc.
I hope you have a blessed day.
Response #10:
You're very welcome.
Regarding your latest question, when it comes to what the Lord wants us to do,
that is asking the right question.
The answer is the same for all: for unbelievers, to put their faith in Jesus
Christ.
For believers, in order to conduct the ministries the Lord has for us and be
effective at them, we first need to become prepared. Obviously, no one ever
successfully pastored the day after receiving Jesus Christ as Savior. To be a
good Bible teacher requires a lot of preparation.
But it's not just pastors who need to prepare. All believers, in order to be
effective for the Lord, need to advance to spiritual maturity first (to grow);
then they need to have that maturity refined through the testing that comes the
way of all mature believers, learning how to walk with the Lord through
adversity (to progress); then it will be made clear to them what ministry the
Lord has for them (to produce), and the conduct of that ministry in a faithful
way is the path to the greatest
eternal rewards (link).
If the Lord gives you an opportunity to witness, and if the Spirit is prompting
you to do so, then that is a wonderful thing. But the kind of effort you seem to
be asking about, putting yourself out there when there is no indication of
response and if you're not being led by the Spirit to do so, will usually not be
effective. Importantly, it also does not produce spiritual growth. In fact it
can stymie it . . . if it is substituting for the taking in of the truth of the
Word of God necessary to grow. Remember, spiritual production is a result of
growth and progress, not a means to it.
As mentioned, I recommend starting with the
Peter series and Bible Basics while
keeping current with the weekly email postings. Curt Omo's
Bible Academy is also a
wonderful ministry from which to grow. Without growth, a believer is just
spinning his/her wheels. See the links.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #11:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
Thank you, I would appreciate an invitation! (I have heard about the forum
indirectly in reading email correspondence).
Something interesting happened at work this past Saturday. My boss and I were
talking in the quiet moments of the morning after we had watered/prepped the
greenhouse for customers. My boss asked me of I had gone to bed early last
night, and I said, "no, I was getting some work done" (since I had worked on a
post the night prior). I said I had a blog and I write to encourage other ladies
in their faith. She asked me to pull up my site on her phone and she read some
on one of my posts.
Turns out she was raised Catholic (on the whole accountability thing, she was
telling me about "confession" and she said it was traumatic) and then married a
Methodist. I don't know where she's at in her relationship with the Lord, but I
think her heart might be open. We were in the office later and she said
something like, "now I know why God sent you here" or "now I know why you came
here". She said, "It was to help me with my faith."
She was talking to me again on Monday, asking where I had learned what I was
writing about. I shared your site with her and sent some links to her.
So I don't know God's plan or how exactly how it will all play out, but I think
He has me here for more than just a job. It was just encouraging that literally
two days after I started focusing on my ministry again, God gave me something to
encourage me in that.
Have a good rest of the week too!
Respectfully,
Response #11:
On the forum, I think you'd enjoy it. I've asked the moderator, to send you an
invite. If you don't hear back within a week at the outside, let me know please
(the messages sometimes end up in spam).
That's very interesting about your boss! That sure does sound like the way the
Lord does things! You weren't pushing anything down her throat at all – you
didn't even probably think she'd ask you about it! And indeed, an encouragement
for you to set a good example with your own growth and walk and to stick with
your ministry too.
I'll pray for her (let me know how it goes).
Keeping you in my prayers as well, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #12:
I've actually looked into Buddhism in the past (largely to try to
evangelize/witness to them someday), and I've realized something:
It's perhaps the most blasphemous religion out there. You say God is beyond any
idea of infinity or limitation anyone could think of right? Nirvana is basically
the same concept, those who reach Enlightenment supposedly ascend to the same
level of that there. "You shall be like God" is truly Satan's most appealing
lie, isn't it? That people fall for this while thinking it's "spiritual growth"
is quite sad but I guess it's only expected with those blinded to the truth.
How do you think one would witness to them?
Response #12:
I don't know too much about this religion – except to say that "emergent
Christianity" is borrowing from it hand over fist.
In terms of characterizing religions, I think it's enough to use the word
"religion". Conversely, we have a saving relationship with the Lord (not a
religion). As we believers know very well, Jesus Christ is the only Way to
salvation. Everything else is just part of the devil's kaleidoscopic world
system designed to distract and divert people from the truth. As I often remark,
the only "religion" that will be excluded from antichrist's syncretic one-world
united religion honoring himself and Satan will be genuine, biblical
Christianity.
In terms of how to witness, I suppose it is true that knowing about a particular
religion or cult gives a believer some insight and therefore possibly an
advantage in witnessing to people connected thereto, but the gospel is the
gospel, the real Witness is the Holy Spirit, and no one can be persuaded into
believing in Christ, not even by someone who deeply understands the falsehoods
into which they have previously bought.
A person has to want to be saved. So on that note, we may desire, for whatever
reason, to want the salvation of some group from some emotional attachment we
have, but that doesn't necessarily change the hearts of any we might witness to.
Paul was deeply desirous of having all unbelieving Jews respond to the gospel,
but they still tried to kill him in Jerusalem and refused to respond when he got
to Rome – and no one understood Judaism as well as the apostle Paul. So we have
to remember what our Lord told us, namely, not to throw pearls before swine,
"lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you" (Matt.7:6
KJV).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #13:
I have a really good friend that is not a believer and we played video games a
lot before I got to believe in Jesus more seriously. Now I had more contact with
him again (because we lost contact after I stopped gaming more or less) and also
talked to him about faith and today we celebrated his birthday. We returned from
a restaurant and where walking together on a path and then he said something. He
said something like he doesn’t know if the new me is better off then the old
one. What have I done so terribly wrong in being a light as a Christian, what
have I done so terribly wrong in my life, what have I done to terribly wrong in
my faith, what have I done so terribly wrong in my walk and relationship with
Christ, for this to happen? After receiving Christ's deliverance I should be a
new being, shining forth to people with the fruits of the spirit, with joy, love
and peace. Yet still he said something like this, that he does not know if the
new me is better off then the old one. I hoped so much for this friend to turn
to Christ, but now I know why he probably doesn’t really feel like doing so yet.
It might just be because through me he just sees a life that is absolutely
undesirable.
Be blessed
Response #13:
Your final statement is wise: "It might just be because through me he just
sees a life that is absolutely undesirable". You really don't know what your
friend means by this. After all, in the eyes of unbelievers, we Christians are
"of all men the most pitiable" (1Cor.15:19), because they refuse to believe in
the resurrection and the truth. If a person doesn't think what we believe in is
true, then of course they will see us as wasting our lives, depriving ourselves,
following fantasies. But WE know that it is true indeed.
If anything, I think the fact that your friend recognizes that you HAVE changed
is a wonderful testimony. We don't control how other react to the truth. But if
they see the truth through us – even though for the moment they may reject it
from their own free will – then we have "done our job" for Jesus Christ. One
never knows how and when the Lord is working in your friend's heart.
So keep giving a good witness – a good witness of the life.
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #14:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
Ok, I wasn't thinking about God handling nations in a somewhat different way
than individual believers - thank you for clarifying that. We studied chapters 3
and 4 on Tuesday and I think it went pretty well! I think I have a basic
understanding of many of the main themes of the Old Testament (like, how
everything was pointing to Jesus coming to save us) and many of the more
well-known accounts (Adam and Eve, Abraham, Joseph), but I don't always
understand the history of Israel or the prophetic passages or some of the more
difficult illustrations that have a deeper meaning. I think this Hosea study
will help some of that, and it is good to read Scripture.
I have been mulling over some things recently. How do I be a good Christian
friend to my other Christian friends, when we don't view the things the same?
[omitted]
Do you think that sharing personal stories and struggles is ever helpful in
ministry? Does anything helpful come out of sharing that - or is it more
harmful? Like, we all have enough struggles of our own. Then again, sometimes
it's helpful to know where someone's coming from. Like if you said, "I used to
struggle with anxiety" and you go into that a little but not to the point of too
much, and then you point them to Jesus and the Bible and say, "this is what you
need". I don't know. Just thoughts I have.
I hope you had a good week!
Respectfully,
Response #14:
Thanks for the update.
What you are bumping into is typical. On the one hand, we all have the need of
and also enjoy relationships with others. But when it comes to the truth, we
need to be careful not to let the immaturity or unbelief of others influence us.
Whether or not we can influence them depends on them more than anything else. It
is possible that the Lord has led us into these situations just exactly so that
we may share a good word of truth at the proper time. However, compromising what
we feel we should be doing and saying is never good. So all this is a case of
judgment calls -- which we get better at making as we draw closer to the Lord.
That goes for sharing too.
I'm praying for you for some good, solid Christian relationships with others who
value the truth as much as you do!
Keeping you in my prayers.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #15:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
I think I have taken my focus off Jesus and gotten distracted by other things -
I think I need to spend time alone with God and quiet myself in His presence. I
know this will solve the "judgement calls" in time. So I guess here I go into
spiritual recovery again....thank you so much for praying for me.
Respectfully,
Response #15:
Life is distracting! We believers have so many "fronts" on which
we are trying to fight and live good Christian lives that sometimes it's a
challenge to keep advancing on the most important front of all: our relationship
with the Lord and our ministry prep or execution.
Getting this balance right is never easy and no one gets it perfect immediately.
And we are all always adjusting. So please don't be down on yourself. Every day
is a new day and we always have to hit "reset" when the alarm goes off in the
morning. Don't look back. Determine to hit it hard tomorrow. The Christian life
is "one day at a time" and we dare not ruin today by being fixated on what we
did (or didn't do) yesterday. This is all about Jesus Christ, not us.
Jesus Christ, yesterday and today [has always been] the same, and [will be] unto the [end of] the ages.
Hebrews 13:8
Keeping you in my prayers, my friend.
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #16:
Hi Bob,
Invite sent. As to the job, well, we have a pretty big release coming up early
August. Will be a bit crazy until then, but such is the nature of the beast. We
have about one of these a year, and inevitably it is always a scramble towards
the end, right before we deploy our code. In practice, this just means my days
at work are a bit more frenetic than usual. Thankfully I don't really need to
work more hours during these times (at least I haven't in the past). Things are
just a bit more chaotic for a bit.
That aside, one short-term thing I'd appreciate if you said a prayer for is AC
repairs. Apparently the blower motor in my HVAC system died, and they'll have to
completely replace it. I'm thankfully still under the manufacturer parts
warranty, but it will still be ~$500 in labor. I just hope the problem is what
they think it is, so that I'll just be out several hundred dollars and that can
be the end of it. For the days until the replacement part arrives (hopefully not
many more now...), I'm surviving with fans. Sort of.
I've got some other big news: I'll finally be launching the in-person arm of my
ministry, come July 12. I do wish things could have materialized faster in the
last several years, but I suppose the somewhat winding route I've taken has
given me plenty of time to look at all the possible paths before settling on
one. The short version of how things shook out is that I am putting a pause on
the formal YouTube content at present, and instead keeping the discussion
recordings group-internal. Aside from not making me so perfectionistic about the
content structure, this also seems to make most people more comfortable talking
(since their words won't end up memorialized in a completely public recording).
In the long-term, I have full plans for producing documentary-style YouTube
videos with high production quality (along the lines of full video scripts,
formal post-processing for background images and videos, etc.). I've settled on
how I want the content to look in the long term, but there is still a lot of
technical work to make all that happen smoothly. But if I am not doing all of
this for the recordings of our live meetings, there is no reason why the live
meetings can't start even before I get all that worked out... hence the current
plan. I'm sort of kicking myself for not figuring out that I could do the latter
even before the former is done until fairly recently, but oh well.
In terms of specifics in prayer:
I have several technical bits to finalize before my target date of July 12,
relating to the recording software/format, mic setup, and so on. Just prayers
that I could get all that worked out smoothly.
I would be thrilled if I had more people show up rather than just one or two,
but I'll settle on being content with whoever the Lord leads to my house for the
in-person studies. I'll be casting my net wide (coworkers, all the church groups
I am semi-involved with, etc.), and just see who sticks around. I just pray God
would bring the right people.
This has been a long time coming (coming on 5 years now since I bought the
house, with somewhat of an eye towards hosting even then...), so I just hope it
will be of interest to at least some people so that all that physical
preparation won't completely go to waste. If not, well some of our friends from
the Ichthys group will now have a second meeting to partake of, I suppose.
(Since I'll be tying everything into Zoom).
Your brother in Christ,
Response #16:
Thanks for this and also for the update. Hearty congratulations on the imminent launch of "face to face" teaching! I'll be keeping the launch and the execution in my prayers, my friend. I have been long praying for a face to face "congregation" for you. Even if it starts small, you'll be up and running and ready for whatever opportunities may offer themselves next year. Being ready and willing is a large part of what "this" is all about.
"So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him. Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom the master has put in charge of the servants in his household to give them their food at the proper time? It will be good for that servant whose master finds him doing so when he returns."
Matthew 24:44-46 NIV
Sorry to hear about the AC. In my experience, a bad blower motor is the least of
what can go wrong and the least expensive (even if it is very expensive). I
wouldn't want to be living any farther south without air conditioning! Come to
think of it, it's been so brutal here of late I'd be lost without it in
Louisville as well. Once upon a time, the windows in this near 120 year old
house opened and there were screens. Those days are long gone.
Looking forward to the upgraded YouTube presentations as well, my friend!
Keep up the good work for Jesus Christ!
In Him,
Bob L.
Question #17:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
I have finished a post on testing and wondered if you wouldn't mind looking at
it? No worries if you can't!
https://growinginjesus.com/why-does-god-test-us/
I used your translation of 1 Corinthians 10:13, as I couldn't find one I liked
that said "testing" in place of "tempting". Is this ok with you? If not, I will
change it right away. I did credit you and linked to your site and made a note
on why I used it.
That's all for now!
Hope you are doing well!
Respectfully,
Response #17:
This is really great (IMHO)!
No worries at all using any of my stuff when it's attributed like this.
N.B., there is no difference in Greek between the two words tempt and test. In
our way of thinking, the two are completely different, but not in Greek – and
not in the NT. So the one doesn't exclude the other or vice versa. All testing
comes with the temptation to fail; all temptation is a test of sorts.
As mentioned before, I'd be happy to link your site to Ichthys (just let me
know).
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #18:
Hi Mr. Luginbill,
Ok, thank you! I will always make sure to make a note if I cite your work.
And thank you for the correction on the testing/tempted! I thought they were
different words/concepts in the Bible too, I guess. I sometimes forget that
translation isn't always a word for word thing. I edited the post.
I would be very happy for you to link me wherever you wish. Thank you again for
looking at the post for me!
Respectfully,
Response #18:
My pleasure.
Link posted. Growing in Jesus: helping
women grow in Christ
And, by the way, you're not wrong about temptation and testing. From our point
of view they are two different things. It's just that the Greek language
considers them essentially the same so that when we translate into English we
have to decide whether the peirasmos is more of a temptation or a trial
and render accordingly. And if we are teaching, we need to keep in mind that if
we translate it one way, the other aspect, if not dominant, is yet still present
to some degree – and thus it's always good to point that out to those we're
teaching.
Keep up the good work for Jesus Christ!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #19:
Hi Bob,
First, I am happy to report my AC got fixed on Tuesday. After all that hassle
getting things arranged, the actual fix went surprisingly quick. But, an answer
to prayer nonetheless, so I'll take it.
As mentioned, the first Bible study for a wide-group audience is scheduled for
this Saturday (July 12), in the evening. Over the last couple days, I've posted
invites in both church groups I've been semi-involved in, sent an invite to
co-workers who are Christian or at least expressed interest in it, sent an
invite to friends from a college Bible study who might join over Zoom, and of
course mentioned it to all of our friends already coming to our weekly Ichthys
Bible study. I also got permission from local church leadership to get up in
front of the room and pitch it in during this week's large-group Bible study for
one of the church communities, so that was cool. I was glad that my efforts were
"blessed", so to speak, rather than being viewed negatively. I had previously
been a bit concerned about that sort of reaction.
In short, the rest is now in God's hands. There hasn't been tons of movement in
people joining the group chats I set up for the new Bible study, but that
doesn't mean they won't show up in-person; only time will tell. It could be 5
people on Saturday, or maybe it will be 30. I am just praying it turns out how
God wishes for it to, and that I can now keep my head down and work the ministry
field before me.
This will sort of be an inflection point for me in my ministry efforts, I think.
It is a bit humbling to think that from here on out I will likely not cease the
weekly Bible studies until I leave this life for one reason or another. I may
miss a week here or there if I am on vacation visiting family or the like, but
we will probably have close to 50 meetings a year, and that means at least 50
recordings a year. And this is just for the wider-group Bible study. We will be
continuing our studies in the Ichthys group as well. So double those numbers
from before, and that will be the general target I shoot for: 100 Bible study
meetings a year, and 100 recordings of those meetings a year.
Now that I have all the infrastructure in place, the Ichthys group Bible study
recordings are going to get a bit more polish now too, since the whole
procedure/process is sort of fully worked out for the first time. The path is
sort of clear before me now, and now all that remains is to walk in it with
consistency and unflagging determination.
There is a bit of change that is coming along with all of this. This launch
represents my ministry really formally "going public". And on that account, the
Bible studies we have been doing with the Ichthys group are going to be opened
up to the public, gated only by interest. Let me explain:
So far, the only place that I ever mentioned the Ichthys Bible study Zoom
meetings was the invite-only forum, and the only people invited were people from
that invite-only community.
But now, the Ichthys Bible study meetings I've been hosting on Zoom are going to
essentially be public-facing too. We will unapologetically study topics from
Ichthys and keep the focus there in this Bible study (whereas my other
wider-group Bible study will be covering topics that are a bit more broad in
scope, insofar as one can separate such matters), but the Ichthys-focused
meetings are being announced openly for the first time. This is a change.
I should note that this is not changing the invite-only nature of the existing
forum. Old conversations that happened in the invite-only group will stay in the
invite-only group. But as part of this formalization of the weekly Bible study
meetings I am hosting as part of my ministry, I am essentially going to be
forming a different Ichthys-focused Bible study group that is not invite-only,
but is public-facing. Right now it only consists of all of our most active
members who have been participating on Signal (i.e., people I know very well,
and who are aware of the new direction and the reasons behind it).
This will require a bit of a different touch in its governance, but I think it
is for the best for what I am setting out to do. One reason is because I will be
inviting people from my broader (Saturday) Bible study to also come to the
narrower Ichthys Bible study on Sundays, if they want "more". Having that
"pipeline" publicly advertised and in-place is important to me. But even more
than that, the biggest reason for having the Ichthys-focused Bible study Zoom
meetings we have been having for years already now opened up more is that it
means people will be able to join the community group chat and start
participating all on their own, with no barriers to entry; it will not be a
walled garden, unlike it has been thus far. To be honest, we've sort of already
been letting most people interested join if they request access, but this is
just taking that to its logical conclusion of letting people join themselves
without any formal invite from me being necessary. They don't have to take that
step of emailing someone to ask to join (which can be a bit intimidating, I take
it), but they will now be able to just do it.
I'll need to hold the reins a bit more firmly in some ways to make sure that the
integrity of the group's purpose is preserved and people are kept spiritually
safe, but this is no different from what happens in physical brick-and-mortar
churches: those also are public/open rather than being invite-only. This is not
to say that the invite-only approach is wrong or inferior. It is just different.
The Teachers group proper (for preparing/serving pastor-teachers) is staying
completely invite-only, and will always remain such, for various reasons we've
discussed before. And I'm going to leave alone the Ichthys community forums that
have been invite-only thus far as well, so that anyone who wants that narrow
group can still have it. It's just there are now two public-facing groups that
will be associated with my weekly Bible studies that are not related to these.
At some time in the future, I may come up with a specific way I'd like some of
this information mentioned on Ichthys (if you are amenable to me suggesting the
exact wording), but I'll leave that as a future TODO at this point.
---------------------------------------------------------
I'd ask for prayer for this week especially (as I launch things), and also in
the next few following weeks as I hopefully find my footing in all of this. All
the long-held plans are turning into reality, which is exciting, but there is
much to be done, and I'm sure there will be a period of adjustment in all of
this.
[omitted]
Your brother in Christ,
Response #19:
Great news about the AC! Also of course about the launch. You've done a great
deal of good work, my friend. I'm praying for this to be a great success
tomorrow.
Re: "a specific way I'd like some of this information mentioned on Ichthys".
I'm willing to advertise it however you'd like. Is there some place / link I
could send people to who express interest (as opposed to asking you to send an
invite)?
I'm sure there will be a lot of challenges, and many of them won't even be
things you anticipated. But the Lord will help you in all of this.
Please let me know how it goes!
In Jesus,
Bob L.
Question #20:
Hi Dr. Luginbill!
Thank you for that, and apologies that I hadn’t more thoroughly read it through.
I do have a question/comment that I’ve probably asked to some extent before:
I know we are tested in our own growth, then we “level up” in maturity to
reaping rewards for work done for the Lord and His Kingdom in our ministries.
I don’t really know what my spiritual gifting is, or have a “ministry” maybe
beyond some clarity of certain responsibilities at this time, but I feel like I
am getting just *torched* with testing.
Is it natural to be getting aggressively tested prior to the ministry part? I am
not sure if that makes sense, but you likely catch my drift.
Have a wonderful day!!
Response #20:
There have been many emails and questions about "what's my ministry?" over the
years (check out in particular the series:
Ministry and Preparation
for Ministry [link is to the most recent one]). There's a lot about
spiritual gifts et al. also in BB 5: Pneumatology.
As I always say, in spite of the indoctrination most of us have from
church-visible experiences of the past, it's wrong to think of ministry in the
denominational "cookie cutter" sense, as if, if one is not a deacon or similar
in a local church, the person is not ministering. The combination of spiritual
gifts the Spirit gives and the differences in us as people plus the
circumstances of life means that no two ministries will ever be exactly the
same. There are, therefore, as many ministries as there are believers who are
willing (and prepared) to minister. So the solution is always the same too. We
grow spiritually and we get to the point of preparation where the Spirit is able
to use us . . . and then He leads us into just the right ministry for us
personally.
And, yes, I do think it's true that we have to be tested and tried first.
Scripture does say something about that:
Don't [appoint] a novice [to a ministry], lest his head swell and he fall under the [same judgment as] the devil.
1st Timothy 3:6
In between being fully prepared and just coming to faith, the Lord gives us
plenty of opportunities to minister, even if they are not directly related to
"the" ministry He will eventually have for us. All believers can pray, can
witness the truth in life and word, and can lend encouragement and even material
support to other believers in need or to other worthy ministries. There are no
real limits, except for our own self-imposed limitations.
In Jesus,
Bob L.